Where's the Duet Wifi 3?
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@deckingman said in Where's the Duet Wifi 3?:
I'm still waiting for a stable version of RRF3 to verify if the step pulse frequency is now as good as the older gen 2 product.
It's very much better now. https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1AWA1wLbOaYzxzdQa5LRZvn9rgEk2BuluHy6-_OnD6FY/edit#gid=0
Duet WiFi hardware designer and firmware engineer
Please do not ask me for Duet support via PM or email, use the forum
http://www.escher3d.com, https://miscsolutions.wordpress.com -
@BDubs said in Where's the Duet Wifi 3?:
................... - processor, or rather pulse rate, was the original yard stick when choosing the Duet. Not the same logic as most who are in dreamworld about speed...more like being able to run say 10:1 mechanical reduction and set the driver to full stepping to mitigate the hysteresis associated with microstepping (and torque loss on top of it) - but that's crazy talk because few can ever fathom what I just wrote and the reason behind it.
I'd be interested to know if RRF3 is on par with RRF2 in terms of max pulse rate, too. I'm config'd with RRF3 right now...but may go back to RRF2 after reading what you wrote.
If that is you usage case, then Duet 3 will be more than adequate in terms of step pulse frequency - even with the old firmware (but of course, you still have the WiFi access problem). For my particular usage case, the requirement stemmed from the need to use>16X micro stepping (ideally as high as 128X) in order to attain the necessary extruder resolution when using a mixing hot end and where one or more filament moves might be single digit percentages of the whole. For normal extruder moves, even such a high micro-step setting isn't a problem but it is when retracting. Like you, I foolishly thought that the higher processor speed would lead to increased performance in that respect so it was more than a little disappointing to find that it was actually much worse (but that may be fixed in the latest firmware).
One other thing about using an SBC for WiFi access is that one first has to wait for the SBC to boot before the Duet itself boots up. That additional boot up time could problematic depending on your usage case.
If it wasn't for the fact that I run >12 stepper motors, I'd be putting the gen 2 Duet back. I do have wired Ethernet so I run the Duet3 in stand alone mode because the RPi doesn't give me any additional functionality to compensate for all it's downsides (I've removed the RPi completely and repurposed it to run home automation instead).
One thing that might sway you towards Duet3 is that expansion boards don't have to be close to the main board like the Duet2/Duex combinations do. So that might simplify the wiring. But again, the list of limitations regarding motor/end stop/probe type/ board combinations might prevent you from putting the expansion board where you would ideally like it to be and/or wiring things in the neatest way. (Something else that I found out the hard way).
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@dc42 said in Where's the Duet Wifi 3?:
@deckingman said in Where's the Duet Wifi 3?:
I'm still waiting for a stable version of RRF3 to verify if the step pulse frequency is now as good as the older gen 2 product.
It's very much better now. https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1AWA1wLbOaYzxzdQa5LRZvn9rgEk2BuluHy6-_OnD6FY/edit#gid=0
No data on that spread sheet for the expansion boards with RC1. They were the most problematic for me with earlier firmware. Any idea what I might expect when doing firmware retraction simultaneously with 3 extruders per expansion board and two boards (so 6 extruders in total).?
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@deckingman said in Where's the Duet Wifi 3?:
No data on that spread sheet for the expansion boards with RC1. They were the most problematic for me with earlier firmware. Any idea what I might expect when doing firmware retraction simultaneously with 3 extruders per expansion board and two boards (so 6 extruders in total).?
Expect the same performance as for 3.2beta1, which is substantially better than for 3.1.0.
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PS - today I finally found and fixed the cause of thermostatic fans blipping on expansion boards. The fix will be in the 3.2 release.
Duet WiFi hardware designer and firmware engineer
Please do not ask me for Duet support via PM or email, use the forum
http://www.escher3d.com, https://miscsolutions.wordpress.com -
@dc42 said in Where's the Duet Wifi 3?:
PS - today I finally found and fixed the cause of thermostatic fans blipping on expansion boards. The fix will be in the 3.2 release.
I'm glad about that. Although it was nothing more than a minor annoyance, I was beginning to doubt my own sanity, being that I seem to be the user who has noticed it.
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I'm also waiting for the duet wifi 3. No interest what-so-ever in a raspberry pi for this application. KISS is gone out the window it seems. I want to upgrade my printers but until the duet wifi 3 is out there just isn't any point at all.
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@minim said in Where's the Duet Wifi 3?:
I'm also waiting for the duet wifi 3. No interest what-so-ever in a raspberry pi for this application. KISS is gone out the window it seems. I want to upgrade my printers but until the duet wifi 3 is out there just isn't any point at all.
Why exactly do you want to go with Duet3? What are the printer upgrades that you plan which will necessitate using Duet3 over the Duet2 ?
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Since nobody answered it - @dc42 What's the forecast look like for the Wifi 2 in terms of availability, End of life announcement etc ? Or do you see the Wifi 2 as a staple in the Duet product line for the next several (<5?) years?
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@BDubs said in Where's the Duet Wifi 3?:
Since nobody answered it - @dc42 What's the forecast look like for the Wifi 2 in terms of availability, End of life announcement etc ? Or do you see the Wifi 2 as a staple in the Duet product line for the next several (<5?) years?
We have quite a number of OEMs using Duet WiFi and Duet Ethernet in their products, so we will continue manufacturing them as long as OEMs want them. But we expect new customers to gravitate towards the Duet 3 series.
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There are also multiple suppliers in China producing their own clones (with varying levels of licence compliance).
As long as there is demand!
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Just to pour some more fuel onto the angry fire...
Here's a nice little low cost device that can add wifi to an ethernet only device.
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@Veti said in Where's the Duet Wifi 3?:
@BDubs said in Where's the Duet Wifi 3?:
The speed of what is better because of the RPi?
the pi 4 has a 4x 1,8 ghz processor. it handles data transfer and processing in sbc mode
The only problem with an SBC it that for many users it doesnt work. even to the point of one user saying the following in another post ...
@NeueKlasse said in Duet 3 6HC Rev. 1.01 Faulty:
i am about to setup a TP-Link Nano and get rid of the Pi4...
And the forum has been littered with posts from users having SBC connection issues to the point where i could quote multiple times that the duet team has advised people to run the duet-3 in standalone mode.....
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@Phaedrux said in Where's the Duet Wifi 3?:
Just to pour some more fuel onto the angry fire...
Here's a nice little low cost device that can add wifi to an ethernet only device.
S.M.H.
And that only supports what the op's point is, that to be able to use the duet 3 with a wireless capability you are FORCED to spend more be that by buying a SBC or a device you mention.
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@CaLviNx Yes, and the demand for a wifi version is duly noted.
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@Phaedrux said in Where's the Duet Wifi 3?:
@CaLviNx Yes, and the demand for a wifi version is duly noted.
it might be noted, from experience it being acted upon is a whole different matter.........
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@CaLviNx Merry Christmas Calvin. I do cherish our little chats. May the new year bring you peace and joy.
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I think an Ethernet version is more versatile.
It is easy to have it support a WiFi connection and you have more control over the quality and range of the WiFi connection.
For those with printer farms one device in WiFi Client mode (as opposed to Access Point mode) can serve all of the printers.
The WiFi in the Duet 2 is so short ranged I had to install an Access Point nearby just to get reliable connections to my printers.
Frederick
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@Phaedrux said in Where's the Duet Wifi 3?:
Just to pour some more fuel onto the angry fire...
Here's a nice little low cost device that can add wifi to an ethernet only device.
Where is this 'angry fire' you speak of ? Thanks for the link on the extender. (You don't think a Duet is all THAT important to me in the grand scheme of life do you? I sure hope not!)
There was a point in time where we could have a civilized discussion (on a discussion forum of all places) and listen/respect differing opinions...Only now did I notice the ability to anonymously downvote posts that don't agree with the herd mentality. That seems like a great way for cowards too inept to, agree to disagree, to bully others. It's sad really.
Anyway...I'd still love to have a Wifi 3, but until then I'll roll with the existing offerings.
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I think I spent around 100 liters of petrol and many Teamviewer sessions helping people to get the Duet2Wifi in their printer working after a network change or relocation of the printer. In my garage I had to place an extra access point to make the Duet2Wifi (and Pi, for that matter) work. All in all the Wifi on the Duet2 series is not great, and from a developer point of view it is quite hard to improve a lot. ESP32 Wifi is not that great either.
And then there is setup. For 'us computer wizards' it is a piece of cake, for many people just wanting to print whatever they download from Grabcad & co it is not.
With Ethernet: plug a cable into the router, open up a browser, go to http://<printername>.local, and it works. Want to add Wifi? That 20-euro TP-Link thing sounds good. Usually TP-link makes decent stuff, so I bet it works a lot better than Duet2Wifi builtin client. At least the antenna does not end up between a steel table and aluminium build plate, really close to some aluminium extrusion.
I think delegating Wifi to a 3rd party device is a good choice, but that's just me.
