Electrical tools recommendations - Installing Maestro

Blacksheep99

Thanks everyone so far. I will heed your advice regarding a crimp tool. Makes no sense risking the board or printer for a few quid

jens55

It is highly unlikely that you would be risking the board but let me tell you from experience that you would most definitely risk your hair and your sanity. Trying to find bad crimp joints is something you'd best avoid. Buy the right tool for the job (which you said you would)! You will never know the amount of frustration you have avoided with that decision !

A Former User

PA-09 is great but for the 3D printers I belive PA-20 is better choice.

the PA-09 is 1.0, 1.4, 1.6 and 1.9
the PA-20 is 1.6, 1.9, 2.0 and 2.3

the pins on the duet2ethernet / duet2wifi / maestro connectors need 1.6 or 1.9 for the part that grabs wire and 2.0 for part that grabs insulation. You can crimp the insulation part with 1.9 if you have to; but it is much better to do it with 2.0, and depending on the wires, you might even wanna do it with 2.3. That's why IMO PA-20 is a much better choice than PA-09 (ideally you get both )

droftarts

There's this useful page on the reprap wiki for crimping: https://reprap.org/wiki/Crimping

I've seen this tool recommended for ferrules (by @dc42 no less): https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Ferrule-Crimper-Cable-Tube-Crimping-Plier-Tool-1200X-Wire-Terminal-Connector-Set/392118937290

I use the HT-225D ratchet crimper, widely available on ebay etc. The nice thing one for crimps, works really well, eg: https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Crimping-Tool-HT-225D-Free-Economy-Delivery/123594079692

I prefer these to the PA-09 or PA-20, as crimping is a two-stage process with them. However, you have to be quite careful about lining up the crimp, and getting the wire in the right place with the ratchet crimpers. Once you've done a few thousand of them, though, you get it right nearly every time! (I handmade 500 wiring looms once...)

Don't forget a good pair of wire strippers, too!

Ian

jens55

I prefer the two step process as I can never get everything lined up at the same time with the single step process. Mind you, after 500 crimps (ouch) I would imagine you have it sorted. On the other hand, 6 months of no crimps and you need another 500 to get back into the swing of things
Engineer makes a nice wire stripper (don't know the number but it's got a green handle)
I would like to add that it is EXTREMELY important NOT to nick the wires because the wire will always fail (eventually) at that nick. So yes, a good stripper is a must! Even with a good stripper, I use the hole for the next size up wire (ie if it's a 24ga wire I will use the 22ga stripping hole)

fcwilt

Get a ratcheted crimper with dies for the contacts you are going to use. It will save time and produce more consistent crimps.

Don't skimp on your tools, get the best you can afford.

Frederick

sinned6915

i will 2nd the 2 step process over the ratcheting ones.

If you have to skimp on funds, consider the IWISS Mini Micro Open Barrel Crimping Tool from somewhere like Amazon.

Its almost as nice as the true engineer brand- they did not do as nice a job on the final finishing of the tool but its done right where it counts. The usual pics don't show the milling on the backside of the tool and that is where its a bit unpolished.

Blacksheep99

Thanks everyone, really useful information. Interesting opinions differ a little but to be expected.

A Former User

major problem IMHO with "ratchet" crimpers (the one with dies) is that I have ~100 of them and another box full of dies for those that have replaceable dies, and there's not a single one that can do all the pins .. and if you take the wrong one, that look like they should work, you usually figure too late you messed up bunch of pins .. on top of that, 50% of those PRC made are just too imprecise ..

for someone asking what tool to get, it's better to have PA-09 and PA-20 to be able to crimp 99% of the connectors .. then, if same person figures he's doing a lot of type X one can get crimpers for type X specifically, but the universality of pa-09 and pa-20 is IMO unprecedented.

droftarts

@jens55 said in Electrical tools recommendations - Installing Maestro:

Mind you, after 500 crimps (ouch) I would imagine you have it sorted.

It wasn't 500 crimps, it was 500 wiring loom sets for 3D printers! About 50 to 60 crimps per wiring loom, as some wires came pre-crimped. It was for the first RepRapPro Ormerod printers. I didn't do it alone, but did do a lot of the crimping; wire stripping and heatshrinking being the other parts. It's a bit like muscle memory doing Molex KK-type crimps now! Fortunately we got a proper wire stripping/crimping machine after the initial run.

Edit: So, realistically, it's about variety and quantity of crimps you are likely to crimp. If you're doing a small amount and various sizes, I'd probably say the PA-09 and PA-20 would be the most suitable, as it covers all eventualities.

Ian

dc42

@smece said in Electrical tools recommendations - Installing Maestro:

for someone asking what tool to get, it's better to have PA-09 and PA-20 to be able to crimp 99% of the connectors .. then, if same person figures he's doing a lot of type X one can get crimpers for type X specifically, but the universality of pa-09 and pa-20 is IMO unprecedented.

...except that for the JST VH pins on Duet 3, it has to be a PA-21.

jay_s_uk

@dc42
Whats the difference between the PA-20 and PA-21?

droftarts

PA-09 does 1, 1.4, 1.6 and 1.9mm
PA-20 does 1.6, 1.9, 2.2 and 2.3mm
PA-21 does 1.6, 1.9, 2.2 and 2.5mm

Ian

jay_s_uk

And I take it the duet 3 JST VH requires the 2.5mm crimp capability?

dc42

@droftarts said in Electrical tools recommendations - Installing Maestro:

PA-09 does 1, 1.4, 1.6 and 1.9mm
PA-20 does 1.6, 1.9, 2.2 and 2.3mm
PA-21 does 1.6, 1.9, 2.2 and 2.5mm

Ian

It's more in the shape of the jaws than the sizes. The PA21 is designed to handle the longer flanges of the VH crimps that grip the insulation.

jay_s_uk

@dc42
Could I get away with the PA-20?

A Former User

@jay_s_uk said in Electrical tools recommendations - Installing Maestro:

Could I get away with the PA-20?

If its just the width of the jaws, you can get away with doing each section in to passes, but its also tricky to partially crimp back and forth to avoid sheering off the wings. for a one or four off I'd try it before ordering the new tool. IWISS also makes several versions, all have greater ranges than the Engineer tools.

On the other hand, if you're in the UK and have money to spend on a universal tool this would be my choice. https://precisehandtools.com/en/crimpingtools/153-pad-02-precision-crimping-tool-kit-interchangeable-dies-hard-case-4989833035396.html

Blacksheep99

Considering we have 3d printers I guess nobody has successfully produced a 3d printed crimping tool?!

dc42

@jay_s_uk said in Electrical tools recommendations - Installing Maestro:

@dc42
Could I get away with the PA-20?

For the VH connectors on Duet 3, I don't think so

A Former User

@dc42 said in Electrical tools recommendations - Installing Maestro:

...except that for the JST VH pins on Duet 3, it has to be a PA-21.

ha, so for Duet3 you are not using the same connectors, here pins have that extra-long flaps that need to curl on themselves before they grip the insulating part of the wire? damn, I need to purchase PA-21 too ...

why the change ?

@droftarts it's not only the width, pa-21 is, according to engineer video, different (do not have one so can't say how they work except from videos) as they can handle those extra long flaps, they curl flaps on itself and press the wire, do not curl half circle and embed in wire like the PA-09 and PA-20 .. at least that's how I understood engineer videos when I ordered mine PA-09 and PA-20

@jay_s_uk I did number of those "long flaps" pins with PA-20 and it holds the wire good but looks tad ugly and tends to bend the back of the pin a bit so it can be harder to push pin into connector... you can stop pressing bit earlier and that helps if you can train your hand.. I did maybe 50 such pins total in my life so don't have too much experience with them but PA-20 got the job done, not ideally but..