Question about IR Sensor and Buildtak
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Here is a 40mm cube with 0 top layers and 0 bottom layers and 1 perimeter. The first layer was printed at 32 mm/s and the rest at 64 mm/s
It was printed without a bed heater and without a part blower/cooler
As you can see bed adhesion is really good on polycarbonate.
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Whitewolf, are you using something like this, I guess? goo.gl/cXpKY3 (link to Amazon, not sure if it's ok, if not, just let me know and I will remove it).
Just a few questions about it, are you using it as it is, just over your bed surface? how do you attach it to the bed? clamps or double side adhesive? What about heating it? I'm just printing PLA and PETG, but for PETG I usually need to heat the bed to 70 degrees. Anything required to use it? (you mentioned sanding it, but I'm not sure if you sand it to maintain/remove the remains, or you had to do it in order to get good adhesion)
I'm really interested, as it's cheaper than buildtak (15Eur 3mm sheet) and seems to be more durable… What color should be the best for the IR Sensor? Those guys sells it in transparent, white, gray, black...
Regards
Edited: I just noticed that the link I've posted is for Acrylic plastic and not for Policarbonate... so I've changed the link
I'm using the black on my Rostock Max with IR probe. I bought the same sheet he linked.
I used 1400 grit paper on it. What you see is done by hand. Wanted to test before putting to much time into it. I'll go back over it with a small orbital sander to get a better final finish, but it's not needed.
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Here is from the inside so you can see there were no bottom layers… No rafts, no glue, no tape no fuss, just print and forget the rest
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Whitewolf, are you using something like this, I guess? goo.gl/cXpKY3 (link to Amazon, not sure if it's ok, if not, just let me know and I will remove it).
Just a few questions about it, are you using it as it is, just over your bed surface? how do you attach it to the bed? clamps or double side adhesive? What about heating it? I'm just printing PLA and PETG, but for PETG I usually need to heat the bed to 70 degrees. Anything required to use it? (you mentioned sanding it, but I'm not sure if you sand it to maintain/remove the remains, or you had to do it in order to get good adhesion)
I'm really interested, as it's cheaper than buildtak (15Eur 3mm sheet) and seems to be more durable… What color should be the best for the IR Sensor? Those guys sells it in transparent, white, gray, black...
Regards
Edited: I just noticed that the link I've posted is for Acrylic plastic and not for Policarbonate... so I've changed the link
I'm using the black on my Rostock Max with IR probe. I bought the same sheet he linked.
I used 1400 grit paper on it. What you see is done by hand. Wanted to test before putting to much time into it. I'll go back over it with a small orbital sander to get a better final finish, but it's not needed.http://i381.photobucket.com/albums/oo254/TheOriginalTwoTone/20170701_152934.jpg
I actually found parts to stick too well especially if you find yourself needing to remove before the print is large enough to pop off. that is why i use the 60 grit.
I started with 120 grit by hand and it gripped too well. The Fleks3d plate that i own is very rough not smooth for the same purpose. Also the bottom surface of the printed part looks nicer when you cannot see individual scrratches which are visible in a lightly sanded version
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I can confirm ABS sticks no heat.
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Yeah, it stuck to the Flesk3d no problem… just wasnt sure without the fancy sand blasted surface good to hear cause this is a lot cheaper to have multiple plates on hand.
I will be testing all of Taulman series as well as some Igus Iglur and Acetal POM filaments which are considered by many impossible to print.... we'll see
I have a couple rolls sitting on my desk waiting for their turn on the printer. -
I have to say I'm surprised no figured this out before. I'm new to 3D Printing , but I've read about so many people going to a lot of trouble to run 24v systems, needing heat spreaders etc… and then this- no heat needed. Best upgrade there is LOL.
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Someone did figure it out before its called Fleks3D…. they made it sound all fancy on kickstarter and charged everyone including me a premium for it..... well that moment when you realize its just a sheet of PC with a roughed surface you kind of feel like a dumbass LoL
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Hi again,
@Whitewolf/@TwoTone, thanks a lot for the pictures, I may give PC a try. However, here in Spain I've only found transparent and white Polycarbonate, which one do you think will work better with the IR Sensor? I think I've at home a 5mm thick transparent PC sheet, so I just need to get something to sand it a bit and give it a try. I may put some blue painter tape in the back to ensure the Buildtak is not affecting the IR Sensor.
I've moved back to the inductive sensor, as with the IR sensor I wasn't able to get consistent results, I tried several times, reducing the number of probe points and reducing the mesh size a bit to ensure the sensor is not getting rogue measurements from the edge of the buildtak and the aluminum. During my tests, I not always get the same Z using the tutorial steps (fair simple steps) and the difference was quite high (from 2.0xx to 2.4xx), and I wasn't able to do a first layer right. I've improved the level of the bed, and I've tested it with both, IR and Inductive sensor, and the IR sensor said again that the surface is a mine field, meanwhile the inductive said the surface was much better (still not perfect). With the inductive sensor the Z Height was much more consistent, and I didn't have any problem with the first layer, so I think the Buildtak is absorbing/reflecting the IR light or the LEDS over the bed are messing with the reads of the sensor.
I've recorded another video: https://youtu.be/csNkRe4nWsM with the process of the mesh bed leveling, where you can see that apparently is working as expected.
However, here you can see that the reading of the sensor is not consistent: https://youtu.be/mAIJ-JJU40Y and that the led is blinking a bit (is not very noticeable in the video), so my impression is that this sensor is not happy with the black Buildtak…
Another interesting thing is that with too many points for the mesh, even with the inductive sensor, the results were actually worse during the print, so I've reduced the number of points tested, and now it seems I got it (with the inductive sensor):
What do you guys think?
Regards
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Regarding the IR sensor, it works better with opaque surfaces than with transparent ones. White opaque should be good.
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The origional Fleks3d plate was clear PC with what looks like a sand blasted surface which made it a glowing white. The IR sensor did not work with it at all (head would crash). You might have good results with your sensor and a sanded surface or you might not. Try it and let us know
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I will try to go today to the hardware store to see what they have.
I think last time I went there they had the transparent I got, and one that is like your's, but white (glossy maybe? not sure about the adjective). I think I still have enough transparent at home to try it as well.
Once sanded, both should be matte, the transparent will be kind of grey, and the white, a non-shiny white… will need to try both. Regarding the sanding, I will get several gr sand paper... regarding how it should look like, how much should I apply the sanding, @whitewolf? What worries me about the sanding is that, as it's a manual process, the surface won't be equal... any advice?
Regards
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white will probably work…
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I just used 60 grit with water until the surface looked completely sanded with no sheen left over. then washed with water and dried the black dried to a whitish greyish on the whiter side. Obviously that effect on clear would be more like a cloudy stained window and white just a dull surface
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i did start with 120 grit but was not happy with the results compared to the original flesk3d plate
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I just came from the hardware store, what they have is no PC but polystyrene, so I didn't buy it… and checking what I have at home, is the same.
I'm now looking for professional builders shops here, to see if they have some rests of the appropriate size to kindly ask for...
I will keep you updated.
Regards
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Where are you in the world also look for Plastic's suppliers rather than Builder type places
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I'm in Spain.
I've found today a place where creates and install street adverts and plastic roofs, and they sold me 2 pieces (1 white, 1 transparent), I will pick it up tomorrow, as I've asked them to cut it to the size I need.
I won't be able to sand it until monday… I will keep you updated.
Cheers
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If you do a light sanding just to take the gloss off, you shouldn't have to worry about an uneven surface.
If you are, use a sanding block to help maintain even pressure.
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PC is pretty tough stuff, you really are not removing any material like you would from softer stuff (just a fine dust). its really about getting an even roughness. If you take a look at the Flesk3D plates which is the commercial equivalent of this. The surface appears to be sand blasted for an even etched glass look and feel.
The closest I could come to the original look and feel is 60 grit wet sanded with a vibrating sander, but a lot of time with a sanding block could accomplish the same thing.
