Stop Firmware Retract and Pressure Advance from Fighting

oliof

Pressure Advance modifies extruder behavior on every segmented move. Firmware retract modifies extruder behavior on some moves. When both do this on the same move, the extruder tries to tie itself into a knot trying to comply with the wishes of both retraction and pressure advance.

Would it be possible to collapse the effects of Firmware Retract and Pressure Advance to avoid this fighting?

gloomyandy

I'm a little confused. Isn't firmware retract only triggered by G10/G11 as generated by the slicer? It may be worth posting an example of the gcode that causes the problem you are seeing and a description/video of what happens.

dragonn

I use both of them and don't see a problem.

oliof

@gloomyandy It does not matter that it's only triggered by G10/G11, it always coincides with DA action.

I will try to post a video when I have the time to go back and investigate this. Currently I solved the problem by disabling PA again.

@dragonn that's great for you.

dragonn

Based what are you say, that how it should work.
PA is for compensating pressure build up in the hotend in different speeds.
When PA would not do its move on retraction you would need different retraction length on different printing speeds. And I can confirm that effect exist on bowden and that is really important when having a full metal hotend where you can not just make the retraction longer at some point.
I was having that issue that without PA when printing 3dbenchy the retraction worked perfectly fine up to the moment when the model cross-section goes small and the slicer slows down, then I would get clog up. With PA that is fine and I don't have to increase my retraction length so it clogs up because of full metal hotend.

oliof

@dragonn I don't have issues with clogging or my all metal hotend's retraction settings. While what you write is an interesting observation, it does not add to my issue here.

dragonn

@oliof said in Stop Firmware Retract and Pressure Advance from Fighting:
it does not add to my issue here.

Ok but what exactly is the issue? Doing PA when doing retraction, what does it cause for you? Because like I describe in my opinion that by itself isn't an issue and shouldn't cause any problems.

oliof

I already said I will provide a more detailed explanation when I have the time. Please stop pestering me about it now.

dc42

Pressure advance is not applied to extruder-only moves, including both firmware and slicer-commanded retractions/reprimes.

bot

@dc42 said in Stop Firmware Retract and Pressure Advance from Fighting:

Pressure advance is not applied to extruder-only moves, including both firmware and slicer-commanded retractions/reprimes.

Perhaps the use of "wipe while retract" could cause the behaviour being described by the OP? It will retract some amount of the retract distance while backtracking along the X/Y path for some distance. Then, it will retract the remaining retraction amount (if any) in a normal retraction move.

Disabling this slicer feature might provide the more intended firmware/PA behaviour.

dragonn

@bot can you even use wipe while retract when doing firmware retract? I think not

bot

@dragonn nice catch, I missed that part somehow.

oliof

@dc42 what's with firmware retract with z hop? Either way, they seem to be applied directly after another which seems to lead to very noisy extruder back-and-forth.

dc42

@oliof said in Stop Firmware Retract and Pressure Advance from Fighting:

@dc42 what's with firmware retract with z hop? Either way, they seem to be applied directly after another which seems to lead to very noisy extruder back-and-forth.

When G10 is executed, retraction happens first, then Z hop. G11 undoes the Z hop, then undoes the retraction.