CNC style Pendant

yeah, the usb hid pendants are popular with the LinuxCNC crowd, both the gamepads and more traditional looking, but while more accurate i found the traditional single mpg pendants cumbersome to use as you need to select one axis to jog at the time.

the basic gamepad provides enough inputs to control jogging and probing, and it's accurate enough to jog around and start probing.

refrences
https://github.com/chrishamm/DuetSoftwareFramework/blob/master/examples/CodeConsole/Program.cs
https://sourceforge.net/p/joy2key/code/HEAD/tree/joy2key.c

zapta

@dc42 said in CNC style Pendant:

could be adapted to drive the PanelDue port using a small board based on an attiny microcontroller

How will this work, in addition to the Panel Due or instead of it?

I am using a tethered PanelDue, so almost a pedant, and having a mechanical or even virtual joystick would simplify moving in x/y and Z compared to the existing Move screen.

T3P3Tony

Very good point! In other win for SBC choice on Duet3!

dc42

@zapta said in CNC style Pendant:

@dc42 said in CNC style Pendant:

could be adapted to drive the PanelDue port using a small board based on an attiny microcontroller

How will this work, in addition to the Panel Due or instead of it?

I am using a tethered PanelDue, so almost a pedant, and having a mechanical or even virtual joystick would simplify moving in x/y and Z compared to the existing Move screen.

Either. From an earlier post:

@danal said in CNC style Pendant:

Note: A PanelDue would not be absolutely required.

BTW, PanelDue has a connector with 3 spare inputs on it. I intended this to be used to support a rotary encoder with push button. This connector might be useful to connect a pendant, however I expect a pendant would need more than 3 inputs.

Danal

@dc42 said in CNC style Pendant:

BTW, PanelDue has a connector with 3 spare inputs on it. I intended this to be used to support a rotary encoder with push button. This connector might be useful to connect a pendant, however I expect a pendant would need more than 3 inputs.

Most of them (that are not USB) just break out all the switch contacts, plus a A,B,A-,B- for the rotary. It would be possible to diode or resistor matrix several of the switches and therefore use fewer pins... however... given that a widely available 3.3V candidate, the ESP32, has LOTS of input pins, my inclination for hobbyist/one-off is to just hook everything to a separate pin, and handle it in the script. Easier to understand for people new-ish to hardware and scripting.

Summary: Probably a small number of pins (but more than 3) in a truly engineered product that will be built in hundreds or thousands; probably a dozen to fourteen pins in a one-off hobbyist style.

P.S. I have been contacted by one user who sent me a wiring diagram. I'll post some of my thoughts here in the next few days.

Fdem

Nice idea

With 3 inputs we can do all we want

The encoder need only 2 inputs
And the third can be for "activate pendant wheel"

All the other feature like :

axis select
ratio select

can be done on paneldue

Danal

@fdem said in CNC style Pendant:

All the other feature like :

axis select

ratio select
can be done on paneldue

Sorry, but no. That usage pattern REALLY misses the point of having a pendant on a CNC machine.

I hope that does not come across as critical... I am only attempting to clearly communicating the "use case" or "user story".

It is often true that when the machine operator is using a pendant, the main HMI (Human Machine Interface, in this case the PanelDue), is out of reach. Far out of reach. Like "Out Of Reach" being defined as "Operator has to get up from laying on the floor and walk completely around a piece of equipment" or similar. Again, this is VERY common on CNC, and can even be the case on 3D Print (I have printer setups that require six or more steps to get from some of the places where I'd be using a pendant, to get from there to the Panel Due... and my stride is almost a meter because I am just a hair under two meters tall.)

Short version: When using a pendant, don't expect to reach other controls. That's why pendants have all of those switches, and not just a wheel.

Fdem

Why paneldue must be fix ?

When i use pendant, i'd like see tool coordinate.

In fact, pendant and encoder wheel can be the same device and when not used is the cnc screen

Danal

Very VERY preliminary ideas for implementation:

Buy one of these for about USD $10 (shipped) on Amazon: https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B079PVCF2G/
Programmable with Arduino IDE, and TONS of input pins.

Follow these directions to set up your Arduino IDE for this board. When the physical board arrives:

Hook it up (USB mini cable)
Use the "Tools" menu, "Board", in the IDE to select ""ESP32 Dev Board".
Select a port just like you do for an Arduino.
There will be a bunch of new settings in "Tools", between "Board" and "Port"... leave them all at default.

From that point, it programs just like an Arduino. Most libraries will work. Any sketch or library that DIRECTLY manipulates hardware registers will not work.

Physical Wiring: Something like this:
0_1566060266676_920e0b1f-d05c-4c15-9cd2-4ba14f43e258-image.png

It is possible that Diodes will be needed on TX2/RX2, if this is "Parallel" with a PanelDUE.

Arduino Sketch: Below is the beginning of an idea that can be expanded. Note, this compiles and outputs correct diagnostics when I ground one of the axis or feedrate switch pins, but I have no way to truly test it, and absolutely no way to test the encoder wheel; so wheel code is just not there (yet).

Also note the "style" or "architecture" of this sketch is VERY "brute force", there would be much more elegant ways to code this. I'm intentionally keeping it simple so beginners can understand, and change, it.

// Duet2_CNC_Pendant
// Intended to run on an ESP32 and interface hardware pendant to Duet3d/RepRap
// controller via TTL serial at 3.3V. Intended to run "in parallel" or "in place"
// of a PanelDue. 
// Example pendants can be found on E-bay; must have individual wires (not usb).

/*
Copyright (c) 2019 Danal Estes, all rights reserved. 
Permission is hereby granted, free of charge, to any person obtaining
a copy of this software and associated documentation files (the "Software"),
to deal in the Software without restriction, including without limitation
the rights to use, copy, modify, merge, publish, distribute, sublicense,
and/or sell copies of the Software, and to permit persons to whom the Software
is furnished to do so, subject to the following conditions:

The above copyright notice and this permission notice shall be included in all
copies or substantial portions of the Software.

THE SOFTWARE IS PROVIDED "AS IS", WITHOUT WARRANTY OF ANY KIND,
EXPRESS OR IMPLIED, INCLUDING BUT NOT LIMITED TO THE WARRANTIES OF MERCHANTABILITY,
FITNESS FOR A PARTICULAR PURPOSE AND NONINFRINGEMENT. 
IN NO EVENT SHALL THE AUTHORS OR COPYRIGHT HOLDERS BE LIABLE FOR ANY CLAIM,
DAMAGES OR OTHER LIABILITY, WHETHER IN AN ACTION OF CONTRACT, TORT OR OTHERWISE,
ARISING FROM, OUT OF OR IN CONNECTION WITH THE SOFTWARE OR THE USE OR OTHER DEALINGS IN THE SOFTWARE.
*/


//Encoder Wheel 
#define WheelA1    39
#define WheelB1    36
#define WheelA2    35
#define WheelB2    34

// Axis Switch
#define SwitchX    33
#define SwitchY    32
#define SwitchZ    27
#define Switch4    26
#define Switch5    25
#define Switch6    23

// Speed Switch
#define SwitchX1   22
#define SwitchX10  21
#define SwitchX100 14

// Second Serial Port (for parallel with, or in place of, PanelDue)
#define RXD2 16
#define TXD2 17


int  feedRate = 1800;
char axis     = 'X';

void setup() {
  Serial.begin(115200);
  Serial.print("");        // Clear any garbage from boot. 
  Serial.println("Duet2_CNC_Pendant initalizing.");
  Serial2.begin(57600, SERIAL_8N1, RXD2, TXD2);  // Baud must match PanelDue (if one is present)

//Encoder Wheel 
pinMode(WheelA1,INPUT_PULLUP);
pinMode(WheelB1,INPUT_PULLUP);
pinMode(WheelA2,INPUT_PULLUP);
pinMode(WheelB2,INPUT_PULLUP);

// Axis Switch
pinMode(SwitchX,INPUT_PULLUP);
pinMode(SwitchY,INPUT_PULLUP);
pinMode(SwitchZ,INPUT_PULLUP);
pinMode(Switch4,INPUT_PULLUP);
pinMode(Switch5,INPUT_PULLUP);
pinMode(Switch6,INPUT_PULLUP);

// Speed Switch
pinMode(SwitchX1,INPUT_PULLUP);
pinMode(SwitchX10,INPUT_PULLUP);
pinMode(SwitchX100,INPUT_PULLUP);
}

void loop() {
  if (digitalRead(SwitchX1  ) == LOW) {feedRate = 1800;}
  if (digitalRead(SwitchX10 ) == LOW) {feedRate = 18000;}
  if (digitalRead(SwitchX100) == LOW) {feedRate = 180000;}
  // Maybe put in logic to only include feedrate if it changed. 

  if (digitalRead(SwitchX) == LOW) {axis = 'X';}
  if (digitalRead(SwitchY) == LOW) {axis = 'Y';}
  if (digitalRead(SwitchZ) == LOW) {axis = 'Z';}
  if (digitalRead(Switch4) == LOW) {axis = '4';}
  if (digitalRead(Switch5) == LOW) {axis = '5';}
  if (digitalRead(Switch6) == LOW) {axis = '6';}

// *******************************************
// Need something to read wheel encoder here. 
// *******************************************

  if (1) {    // Need "if the wheel moved" logic here. 
    // How far to move?? Numerically?
    int m = 10; 
    Serial.printf("G0 %c%d F%d\n",axis,m,feedRate);   // For Debugging
    // Possible need to listen before transmitting to avoid collisions.
    Serial2.printf("G0 %c%d F%d\n",axis,m,feedRate);   
  }
 // Required somewhere in main loop on ESP chipset to allow background tasks.
 yield(); 
 // If any part of sketch does not yield() or delay() for about 3 seconds, chip will reboot. 
} // End main loop

Danal

@fdem said in CNC style Pendant:

Why paneldue must be fix ?

This is not a "fix" for panelDUE, it will not affect existing panelDue at all.
It is an addition, for people who prefer a "hard click" wheel to a touch screen. By all means, anyone who likes the screen should stick with it.

When i use pendant, i'd like see tool coordinate.

In fact, pendant and encoder wheel can be the same device and when not used is the cnc screen

Then you are in great shape. Use the screen you have.

There are some other folks that specifically want a pendant with a click wheel, not a touch screen.

Fdem

I already done my own pendant
I use a a chinese pendant and a stm32f407 board from waveshare

It work pefectly

Why can't do a really simple pendant with only the most important thing for me :

the rotary encoder

dc42

If we ever manufacture a pendant interface, we will use a attiny44a processor, because it can be obtained in a small package (smaller than the attiny25 or attiny45), is cheaper than the attiny45, and we already use them in two types of filament monitor and the Smart Effector. It's only work pending for Duet 3 that is stopping us making a prototype now.

I appreciate that for someone building a one-off, using an Arduino Pro Micro or ESP8266 board or Teensy or similar is easier.

Danal

@fdem said in CNC style Pendant:

I already done my own pendant
I use a a chinese pendant and a stm32f407 board from waveshare

It work pefectly

That is fantastic. Are you willing to share the exact pendant, the wiring, and the STM code?

Why can't do a really simple pendant with only the most important thing for me :

the rotary encoder

I'm confused... you just said you already have one that works perfectly? Are you asking for something else to be developed?

Fdem

@danal said in CNC style Pendant:

I'm confused... you just said you already have one that works perfectly? Are you asking for something else to be developed?

i have just reply to this post
for me it's possible to have a usefull simple pendant with only 3 inputs

@dc42 said in CNC style Pendant:

BTW, PanelDue has a connector with 3 spare inputs on it. I intended this to be used to support a rotary encoder with push button. This connector might be useful to connect a pendant, however I expect a pendant would need more than 3 inputs.

Danal

@fdem said in CNC style Pendant:

@danal said in CNC style Pendant:

I'm confused... you just said you already have one that works perfectly? Are you asking for something else to be developed?

i have just reply to this post
for me it's possible to have a usefull simple pendant with only 3 inputs

@dc42 said in CNC style Pendant:

BTW, PanelDue has a connector with 3 spare inputs on it. I intended this to be used to support a rotary encoder with push button. This connector might be useful to connect a pendant, however I expect a pendant would need more than 3 inputs.

Again, that's great. As you point out, a rotary encoder only needs two inputs... phase A and B (plus power and ground). Again, this discussion is about doing more than just the encoder.

Also again, are you willing to share what you have done? Post a wiring diagram? Post the code? Here, or on github?

Fdem

Yes i'll share soon

Skysurfer

@dc42 Hi, new to this forum. I've just put together a CNC router, specifically a Workbee. I'm gobsmacked there's no way to use either the keyboard (ethernet), or a pendant. Or am I missing something? I may have been spoilt having come over from Mach3, as the Duet is a modern board.
No idea if this is the best place to renew the interest in this, but does anyone realise just how many people would love this facility?

When I replied to this thread, I was informed that it was an old thread. August last year? Six months is old?

TIA, & stay safe!

@Skysurfer said in CNC style Pendant:

but does anyone realise just how many people would love this facility?

To be blunt; not enough* - but that probably will change as more CNC users start using Duet boards. Ofc you can argue "build it and they will come". I'm still planning on making a USB gamepad work with the Duet3 and RaspberryPi but not before the RepRapFirmware and DuetSoftwareFoundation is more mature. The majority of the Duet users are 3d-printing and have a limited need for a pendant.

This approach is also quickly becoming more relevant as next iteration of the Duet 2 family will most likely also support interfacing to a Raspberry Pi or other singble board computer.

*)duet people have talked about making a pendant interface, but also after Duet3 is more stable

gtj0

Actually, I've got Python code mostly written that recognizes keypresses from programmable keypads like this one and sends them to the DSF. It actually works with most USB HID devices including things like foot switches.

Maybe I'll finish it one day.

You have to have 2 right feet to use this one though.

dc42

For those using Duet 3 + SBC there are plenty of USB-connected CNC pendants available, and I expect someone will write a DSF plugin for them soon.

For other Duet users, what's needed is a a board based on a small MCU to convert the signals from something like this https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/EU-Send-4-Axis-MPG-CNC-Machine-Controller-Handwenheel-Pendant-w-Emergency-Stop/273588909379 to serial commands to feed to the PanelDue port. We've had it in mind to design one for some time, but we haven't found time to do it yet.

If anyone is interested in using a v3 PanelDue controller board for this, I can help with the firmware, because the PanelDue firmware already has most of the necessary functions. Alternatively, an Arduino Nano probably has enough pins.